Yes but people seem to really want a SteamOS like experience on their desktop. Thats what Bazzite provides.
I dont think steamOS is a good desktop experience but if that makes people feel safe enough to try linux then I think Bazzite does a 100x better job than SteamOS.
If they want an actual desktop that can game and do everyything then they should try Fedora with KDE.
Linux Mint hides and automates a little too much for my liking.
Arch should be within my skill lvl but most days I don’t want to be tuning the suspension while the vehicle is moving.
Endeavour seem the right cup of tea for someone who has grown up using DOS and terminals and still retains the ability to touch type at 50wpm.
I’m a daily driver of Bazzite and Bluefin. I felt this way initially but it’s been generally painless. I typically check flatpak -> app image -> homebrew -> distrobox when I need something. If that fails, I use rpm-ostree and reboot.
I work in development/devops/infosec by trade and to date there hasn’t been a single package or program that I needed that I couldn’t get running with minimal fuss. I’ve even run a couple of MDM packages that my work requires.
Edit: wasn’t trying to to come off as a dick, reread it and I could see it taken that way
Also I’m relatively new to Linux, so I’m sure with some things that may not be true, but 100% of what I’ve had to do has been either within discover, or I’ve followed pages on fedora to find out and it’s worked Everytime. Whatever bazzite installation you have whether it’s 38/39 etc, those line up with fedora versions as far as I’m aware.
It’s been solid for me. It’s the same or less amount of troubleshooting I’d have to do on windows, and I’m familiar with windows. Making windows work is my job. That coupled with the absolute mess that is windows support pages, bazzite has been good for me. Arch was pretty cool too, not nearly as bad as people said it was going to be, I just had an issue with audio I couldn’t figure out. I just wanted a works right now solution, and that’s what it’s been.
So I think I was partially wrong about this one. I just threw my head against the wall for a good hour because I couldn’t get a package installed through dnf.
I don’t know what all this applies to, but I think it may be most things, using rpm-ostree in place of dnf and my install finally worked.
Leaving this here in case someone stumbles up on this while trying to install packages
I can attest to this. I daily drive bazzite exclusively now.
Rocket league specifically only uses 40% of the GPU and 25% CPU and refuses to use any more at all. It is only a bazzite problem. Other distros are completely fine and other bazzite users have reported the same thing, regardless of settings, launch options, etc…
It is hell when trying to do embedded firmware development. Pretty much everything has to be done through distrobox related to it because JLink needs to be accessible by NRF connect which has to be accessible by VSCode, etc… vscode and oss versions simply don’t work if you have to install more than the very basic UI extensions.
Plus then you have udev rules that you have to manually place in the read only file system (recommended by a Bazzite maintainer on their discord) which they explicitly tell you never to do in the docs. There is absolutely nothing regarding JLink (the most widely used industry flashing tool for ARM) in any universalblue docs, even the bluefin and aurora versions “for developers”.
Also, there is absolutely no known way to handle eID credentials, crypto keys, etc in order to digitally sign documents. Also key management and access simply does not work at all in flatpak.
Network scanning simply doesn’t work at all (yes, saned is set up). It is completely nonfunctional, it can’t discover anything.
Outside of those cases though, it works fine. Themes work, font installation works as expected: the firewall, KiCAD, freeCAD work, browsers, media players, etc… All work fine. Distrobox, while start menu applications via distrobox sometimes simply don’t start, they often work fine. However, I haven’t had to worry about updating my system in 4 months because updates are in the background and completely seamless and not a single thing breaks during updates which by itself is the reason I switched from arch.
(Arch never became unbootable or seriously broken in 8 years, but I would have update problems and have to search for forum solutions to make a full update work every month or two)
Why are you still using it if you’re having this many issues? Is it just because you don’t want to go through the hassle of a reinstall at the moment or are there features that you don’t want to go without?
I’ll be honest. It was a hell of a time getting things working correctly due to the lack of documentation, but now I have everything except scanning and document signing working which I rarely use anyway. (Rocket league runs fine, just with half the fps I should be getting) I literally don’t have to touch anything anymore, it will just keep itself updated and working completely hands-off. That is what I want out of a system now that tweaking and debugging is a distraction from my other hobbies rather than a hobby itself.
The biggest feature that I like is Linux without having any manual update intervention at all. It all just runs and updates itself and works.
If something goes wrong in my software, I can uninstall and reinstall the flatpak delete remaining files, and reinstall with 3 clicks instead of having to search for where the hell this specific program decided to stash its files and configs and cache on my system like I had to with a traditional system. It takes the recurring annoyances out and trades them with 1-time annoyances.
Successfully, many times, it’s extremely rare that I have to actually talk with someone directly because so much has already been accurately documented.
I work with windows and those forums don’t do shit
I work with windows and those forums don’t do shit
I’ve gotten to the point that every time I’m directed to Microsoft Help I automatically downvote whatever the MS rep posts, because it will never not be garbage
They just keep saying shit like “what version are you on?” Motherfucker, the latest, and honestly, we know there isn’t a version where you fixed this problem thousands have been trying to solve for months and in a lot of cases years.
Idk how accurate this is, my boss had mentioned it, but apparently they’ve outsourced that shit to a third party, and they just keep opening tickets and solving them and keep asking you simple shit so they can bill per ticket solved. It’s a godamn mess. I’m just hoping Linux catches on enough to enter the corporate world at the user level.
We’re at a point where when something breaks, usually a Linux update fixes it, and it’s windows equivalent just keeps further breaking itself.
From what I’ve heard at work and from others, MS uses version queries to stall tickets because they constantly release updates that they can point to and say “you need to update before we can help”.
It’s built on top of Arch. The distro I’m using is Garuda, which is also built on Arch, and there’s a gaming version that includes everything you need to play games immediately. No one should use SteamOS probably for a desktop. They should use something like Garuda. SteamOS is for a console-like experience.
Because W10 will hit EOL sooner than later; and I have to support that shit professionally.
Doesn’t matter that no one is testing or building applications for W11, no security patches mean any employer worth their salt will switch over to W11, despite not having the infrastructure to do it.
Admin VS IT. I’m nearly 40, and that story is older than I am.
Don’t use SteamOS as a desktop OS, that’s not what it’s meant to. You might be used to Windows and think that a different distribution of Linux is just a different customization of the OS, but it’s almost an entirely different OS that happens to run the same binaries.
If you’re interested in getting an alternative to Windows, try some beginner friendly Linux distros on a Virtual Machine or an old laptop. I recommend Linux Mint to newcomers, but if you’re used to the desktop mode on SteamOS maybe Kubuntu. The closest you can get is Bazzite but that’s also not a desktop OS so I wouldn’t use that unless it was for a Steam Machine. The second closest (that’s also somewhat beginner friendly) is Manjaro K DE version, but being Arch based I don’t tend to recommend it to new Linux users, but of you’re dead set on getting something as close as possible to SteamOS that’s it.
Cool, so did I a while back, what’s your point? It’s still not a great replacement for Windows as it’s not the intended use of the OS, and will be frustrating for someone without Linux experience.
I don’t want a replacement for windows and steam OS is about as intuitive as Linux gets. If it’s too complicated for someone they probably shouldn’t be using Linux.
Some of us legitimately want to build a gaming PC around steamOS. Stop telling us what we do or don’t want. Stop treating people like they’re tech illiterate because they’re not doing what you would do. I have 3 different distros on 3 different machines running right now - I know what I want and i know what steamOS can/can’t do. You do you.
SteamOS even now is a decently capable desktop OS. If you want more than gaming as the central focus then sure look elsewhere. But you’re just being obnoxious and condescending about it.
Yes, for you and me who understand what that means it’s just the same, but for someone with no Linux experience is going to be very different. Googling any issue he has will direct him to alter config files or install packages, neither of which would be permanent on SteamOS, while the OS is the same the usage of it is completely different, so for a person with no Linux experience to try to use it as their daily desktop system it would be frustrating because none of the help online would apply to him.
No this is a super out of date version that was not designed for general desktop use. It is specifically designed for the steam machine which was a failure. Value really needs to take this page down so people arent downloading a 9 year old version of linux.
Well good news: They’ve also recently announced that they’re going to be updating it to be the same as what’s on the Deck. THough we probably won’t see an actual release until either just before or just after the new version of the deck is officially announced/released.
Also: The failure of the Steam Machine had little to do with the operating system and more to do with the fact there was not one singular “Steam Machine.” It was any number of prebuilt PCs with extra stupid steps. TO say it wasn’t meant for general desktop use is bullshit; a Steam Machine was nothing more than a desktop PC running this OS.
At the time of the steam machine wine was not in a good state (from what i’ve heard, I wasnt a linux user at the time) and gaming relied on Valve getting devs to port things to SteamOS 2.
Wine was in a great state, it just wasn’t integrated on Steam so it was clunky to get it working. Long story short Steam Machines only had a handful of games available (those with native binaries) unless you jumped through hoops to install steam on wine and launch steam from steam or something of the sort.
At the time we thought that the steam machines would make devs port their games, but that didn’t happen, so Valve invested heavily on Wine to make the games come to Linux regardless of the game devs. If Valve hadn’t invested most games that run today would still run, wine has always been an amazing piece of technology, their investment was mostly on a library called dxvk which translates directX calls to Vulkan instead of OpenGL, for technical reasons this was needed for any game that only supports DX12, but also gave some performance boost to other titles. I’m not trying to downplay Valve’s hand, dxvk was a much needed piece of the puzzle that Valve singlehandedly financed, not to mention all of the other stuff they’ve done that benefitted Linux gamers over the years, but if they had integrated wine on Steam without dxvk 99% of cases would be mostly the same (but that 1% are heavy hitters).
Here’s hoping it matures enough for desktop use by the time my Win10 desktop is EOL.
My man, have you heard of Bazzite?
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Yes but people seem to really want a SteamOS like experience on their desktop. Thats what Bazzite provides.
I dont think steamOS is a good desktop experience but if that makes people feel safe enough to try linux then I think Bazzite does a 100x better job than SteamOS.
If they want an actual desktop that can game and do everyything then they should try Fedora with KDE.
For a desktop PC I’m trying Endeavour OS. Feels quite good.
Endeavour is great as well. I’ve heard nothing but good things about it.
Linux Mint hides and automates a little too much for my liking. Arch should be within my skill lvl but most days I don’t want to be tuning the suspension while the vehicle is moving. Endeavour seem the right cup of tea for someone who has grown up using DOS and terminals and still retains the ability to touch type at 50wpm.
But SteamOS is also immutable 🤔
I’m a daily driver of Bazzite and Bluefin. I felt this way initially but it’s been generally painless. I typically check flatpak -> app image -> homebrew -> distrobox when I need something. If that fails, I use rpm-ostree and reboot.
I work in development/devops/infosec by trade and to date there hasn’t been a single package or program that I needed that I couldn’t get running with minimal fuss. I’ve even run a couple of MDM packages that my work requires.
I’m not shy about Linux but my eyes glazed over reading that flow chart. Don’t pretend this is okay for typical users switching from Windows
If they went through this, they wouldn’t.
I’ve also been able to find 99% of what I need through discover.
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/quick-docs/installing-from-source/
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if you need specific drivers that arent in a generic kernel you’re already out of everyday user territory even on a normal distro.
deleted by creator
That’s why we got dem tar and dnf
And also that’s just not true. There’s also Space Cadet Pinball
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No, on bazzite because it’s a fedora distro
Edit: wasn’t trying to to come off as a dick, reread it and I could see it taken that way
Also I’m relatively new to Linux, so I’m sure with some things that may not be true, but 100% of what I’ve had to do has been either within discover, or I’ve followed pages on fedora to find out and it’s worked Everytime. Whatever bazzite installation you have whether it’s 38/39 etc, those line up with fedora versions as far as I’m aware.
It’s been solid for me. It’s the same or less amount of troubleshooting I’d have to do on windows, and I’m familiar with windows. Making windows work is my job. That coupled with the absolute mess that is windows support pages, bazzite has been good for me. Arch was pretty cool too, not nearly as bad as people said it was going to be, I just had an issue with audio I couldn’t figure out. I just wanted a works right now solution, and that’s what it’s been.
@kadup
So I think I was partially wrong about this one. I just threw my head against the wall for a good hour because I couldn’t get a package installed through dnf.
I don’t know what all this applies to, but I think it may be most things, using rpm-ostree in place of dnf and my install finally worked.
Leaving this here in case someone stumbles up on this while trying to install packages
I can attest to this. I daily drive bazzite exclusively now.
Rocket league specifically only uses 40% of the GPU and 25% CPU and refuses to use any more at all. It is only a bazzite problem. Other distros are completely fine and other bazzite users have reported the same thing, regardless of settings, launch options, etc…
It is hell when trying to do embedded firmware development. Pretty much everything has to be done through distrobox related to it because JLink needs to be accessible by NRF connect which has to be accessible by VSCode, etc… vscode and oss versions simply don’t work if you have to install more than the very basic UI extensions.
Plus then you have udev rules that you have to manually place in the read only file system (recommended by a Bazzite maintainer on their discord) which they explicitly tell you never to do in the docs. There is absolutely nothing regarding JLink (the most widely used industry flashing tool for ARM) in any universalblue docs, even the bluefin and aurora versions “for developers”.
Also, there is absolutely no known way to handle eID credentials, crypto keys, etc in order to digitally sign documents. Also key management and access simply does not work at all in flatpak.
Network scanning simply doesn’t work at all (yes, saned is set up). It is completely nonfunctional, it can’t discover anything.
Outside of those cases though, it works fine. Themes work, font installation works as expected: the firewall, KiCAD, freeCAD work, browsers, media players, etc… All work fine. Distrobox, while start menu applications via distrobox sometimes simply don’t start, they often work fine. However, I haven’t had to worry about updating my system in 4 months because updates are in the background and completely seamless and not a single thing breaks during updates which by itself is the reason I switched from arch.
(Arch never became unbootable or seriously broken in 8 years, but I would have update problems and have to search for forum solutions to make a full update work every month or two)
Why are you still using it if you’re having this many issues? Is it just because you don’t want to go through the hassle of a reinstall at the moment or are there features that you don’t want to go without?
I’ll be honest. It was a hell of a time getting things working correctly due to the lack of documentation, but now I have everything except scanning and document signing working which I rarely use anyway. (Rocket league runs fine, just with half the fps I should be getting) I literally don’t have to touch anything anymore, it will just keep itself updated and working completely hands-off. That is what I want out of a system now that tweaking and debugging is a distraction from my other hobbies rather than a hobby itself.
The biggest feature that I like is Linux without having any manual update intervention at all. It all just runs and updates itself and works.
If something goes wrong in my software, I can uninstall and reinstall the flatpak delete remaining files, and reinstall with 3 clicks instead of having to search for where the hell this specific program decided to stash its files and configs and cache on my system like I had to with a traditional system. It takes the recurring annoyances out and trades them with 1-time annoyances.
I’m with you. Love Bazzite in the living room, but no way would it be my daily driver.
I don’t really like immutable but isn’t that what rpm-ostree is for?
Yes we’ve all heard of bazzite and what we want is SteamOS.
Or literally any other distro.
Pop is probably much easier to be up and running vs. Bazzite.
What’s keeping you from using a distro that’s already designed for desktop use?
Have you tried getting help on a basic question from a Linux forum?
Successfully, many times, it’s extremely rare that I have to actually talk with someone directly because so much has already been accurately documented.
I work with windows and those forums don’t do shit
I’ve gotten to the point that every time I’m directed to Microsoft Help I automatically downvote whatever the MS rep posts, because it will never not be garbage
They just keep saying shit like “what version are you on?” Motherfucker, the latest, and honestly, we know there isn’t a version where you fixed this problem thousands have been trying to solve for months and in a lot of cases years.
Idk how accurate this is, my boss had mentioned it, but apparently they’ve outsourced that shit to a third party, and they just keep opening tickets and solving them and keep asking you simple shit so they can bill per ticket solved. It’s a godamn mess. I’m just hoping Linux catches on enough to enter the corporate world at the user level.
We’re at a point where when something breaks, usually a Linux update fixes it, and it’s windows equivalent just keeps further breaking itself.
From what I’ve heard at work and from others, MS uses version queries to stall tickets because they constantly release updates that they can point to and say “you need to update before we can help”.
I downloaded an extension that blocks sites I want just to block that garbage of a site
The ones on Lemmy are pretty good!
It used to be bad. In the last few years, it isn’t. We want other people to use Linux now.
A few times, why?
Dude, you don’t need SteamOS for a desktop. Just download a more widely used desktop distro. I use Garuda, and it’s great for starting up gaming.
SteamOS will be great for a console-like experience out of the box, which is not what you want for desktop.
That is exactly why many of us want it. We know what we’re asking for. And yes we know bazzite exists.
It’s just arch isn’t it?
No, it’s based on arch. There’s a bunch of polish on top of it that makes it more stable and such
I don’t speak polish though so that makes it difficult and scary.
You don’t have to talk to them, they just hold the thing together. Very strong men
Juyzt sprynkle some 'y’s and 'z’s whyle talking wyth them.
Dyslexia strikes again
I didn’t think it’s just Arch , though. IIRC it’s also immutable.
Yeah I don’t see any need for desktop use, except for making a Steam console under your TV.
You can use Steam with Proton on whatever distro you want.
It’s built on top of Arch. The distro I’m using is Garuda, which is also built on Arch, and there’s a gaming version that includes everything you need to play games immediately. No one should use SteamOS probably for a desktop. They should use something like Garuda. SteamOS is for a console-like experience.
I really want to switch my main desktop to Linux, but use it for remote work too, so I have MS Teams… is there a way to reliably virtualize it?
Teams can run as a chrome app, I use it daily.
Krdc
https://itsfoss.com/remote-desktop-tools/
I’m on W11 with my daily driver.
I don’t like it. I didn’t like it from the start.
So why?
Because W10 will hit EOL sooner than later; and I have to support that shit professionally.
Doesn’t matter that no one is testing or building applications for W11, no security patches mean any employer worth their salt will switch over to W11, despite not having the infrastructure to do it.
Admin VS IT. I’m nearly 40, and that story is older than I am.
I already jumped to linux and I abandoned adobe as a graphic designer. I feel so free now. The tool don’t make the profesional.
Don’t use SteamOS as a desktop OS, that’s not what it’s meant to. You might be used to Windows and think that a different distribution of Linux is just a different customization of the OS, but it’s almost an entirely different OS that happens to run the same binaries.
If you’re interested in getting an alternative to Windows, try some beginner friendly Linux distros on a Virtual Machine or an old laptop. I recommend Linux Mint to newcomers, but if you’re used to the desktop mode on SteamOS maybe Kubuntu. The closest you can get is Bazzite but that’s also not a desktop OS so I wouldn’t use that unless it was for a Steam Machine. The second closest (that’s also somewhat beginner friendly) is Manjaro K DE version, but being Arch based I don’t tend to recommend it to new Linux users, but of you’re dead set on getting something as close as possible to SteamOS that’s it.
I use my steam deck with steamOS as a desktop OS several days a week.
Cool, so did I a while back, what’s your point? It’s still not a great replacement for Windows as it’s not the intended use of the OS, and will be frustrating for someone without Linux experience.
I don’t want a replacement for windows and steam OS is about as intuitive as Linux gets. If it’s too complicated for someone they probably shouldn’t be using Linux.
Some of us legitimately want to build a gaming PC around steamOS. Stop telling us what we do or don’t want. Stop treating people like they’re tech illiterate because they’re not doing what you would do. I have 3 different distros on 3 different machines running right now - I know what I want and i know what steamOS can/can’t do. You do you.
SteamOS even now is a decently capable desktop OS. If you want more than gaming as the central focus then sure look elsewhere. But you’re just being obnoxious and condescending about it.
That’s exactly my point, OP talked about replacing Win 10 desktop, not about a gaming machine (for which I agree SteamOS is an excellent choice).
They just said desktop use. Not a wholesale windows replacement. You can’t use current steamOS as a desktop outside of a steamdeck.
What?
As far as I know, it’s literally just an immutable build of Arch Linux.
Yes, for you and me who understand what that means it’s just the same, but for someone with no Linux experience is going to be very different. Googling any issue he has will direct him to alter config files or install packages, neither of which would be permanent on SteamOS, while the OS is the same the usage of it is completely different, so for a person with no Linux experience to try to use it as their daily desktop system it would be frustrating because none of the help online would apply to him.
It originated as a desktop os and you can download it right now
No this is a super out of date version that was not designed for general desktop use. It is specifically designed for the steam machine which was a failure. Value really needs to take this page down so people arent downloading a 9 year old version of linux.
Well good news: They’ve also recently announced that they’re going to be updating it to be the same as what’s on the Deck. THough we probably won’t see an actual release until either just before or just after the new version of the deck is officially announced/released.
Also: The failure of the Steam Machine had little to do with the operating system and more to do with the fact there was not one singular “Steam Machine.” It was any number of prebuilt PCs with extra stupid steps. TO say it wasn’t meant for general desktop use is bullshit; a Steam Machine was nothing more than a desktop PC running this OS.
At the time of the steam machine wine was not in a good state (from what i’ve heard, I wasnt a linux user at the time) and gaming relied on Valve getting devs to port things to SteamOS 2.
Wine was in a great state, it just wasn’t integrated on Steam so it was clunky to get it working. Long story short Steam Machines only had a handful of games available (those with native binaries) unless you jumped through hoops to install steam on wine and launch steam from steam or something of the sort.
At the time we thought that the steam machines would make devs port their games, but that didn’t happen, so Valve invested heavily on Wine to make the games come to Linux regardless of the game devs. If Valve hadn’t invested most games that run today would still run, wine has always been an amazing piece of technology, their investment was mostly on a library called dxvk which translates directX calls to Vulkan instead of OpenGL, for technical reasons this was needed for any game that only supports DX12, but also gave some performance boost to other titles. I’m not trying to downplay Valve’s hand, dxvk was a much needed piece of the puzzle that Valve singlehandedly financed, not to mention all of the other stuff they’ve done that benefitted Linux gamers over the years, but if they had integrated wine on Steam without dxvk 99% of cases would be mostly the same (but that 1% are heavy hitters).