Signal is the world’s most widely used truly private messaging app, and our cryptographic technologies provide extra layers of privacy beyond the Signal app itself. Since launching in 2013, the Signal Protocol—our end-to-end encryption technology—has become the de facto standard for private commu...

We estimate that by 2025, Signal will require approximately $50 million dollars a year to operate—and this is very lean compared to other popular messaging apps that don’t respect your privacy.

    • Kaldo
      11•1 year ago

      You can also just hook up any old phone or computer, install the app, and let it run as the server.

      If you have a static IP address, if you want to bother with securing and maintaining it, if you’re willing to deal with downtime when something inevitably breaks, if you’re willing to deal with lost data or also maintaining a backup solution, if… a dozen other things that most people don’t want to deal with.

        • Kaldo
          2•1 year ago

          Keet is closed-source app with built-in crypto, I am not touching it with a 10ft pole. Holepunch does sound like interesting technology at first glance. It doesn’t solve any of the issues mentioned above besides connectivity however.

      • admiralteal
        1•1 year ago

        Sure, but you also just… don’t have to do that. None of that is necessary fore core functionality of a messaging service, IF you stipulate that both devices must be online at the same time to ping each other.

        The only thing you need is some very basic addressing service so they can find each other, and there are entirely P2P solutions for this that already exist and work without issue. See: bittorrent.

        The ONLY drawback of having no server, fundamentally, is that the two devices need synchronicity. If they both aren’t online at once, messages won’t get delivered. Which is not a big deal for a modern smartphone given that most of them are online close to all of the time.

        • Kaldo
          6•1 year ago

          I’m not really going to get into the technical aspect since I feel neither of us know enough to tell how feasible it is (although I think you’re wrong since you do need trackers in order to find at least one other member of the swarm), but this part

          If they both aren’t online at once, messages won’t get delivered. Which is not a big deal for a modern smartphone given that most of them are online close to all of the time.

          I just a horrible take. You can’t base your business model on “modern phones being online close to all of the time”. You can’t have random data loss whenever someone goes out of service area, has to turn on airplane mode, runs out of battery, has a software error or just an update or some other kind of temporary downtime? That’s not how you design any software, less alone a dependable messaging service. You can’t just “stipulate that”.

          • conciselyverbose
            2•1 year ago

            Nothing gets lost. Not having every packet get delivered is already entirely normal on any internet application, and already solved.

            Solving that “problem” is as simple as sending an acknowledgement back when a message is received, and retrying when acknowledgement isn’t received. Routing P2P is more (but not very) complicated than that is.

          • admiralteal
            1•1 year ago

            What business model? Why does a messaging app need to be a business? And again, how is someone who doesn’t have service supposed to be receiving/sending messages? Makes no damn sense.

            Basically all bittorrent programs include allowing a peer to act as a tracker directly.