On Sunday, U.S. President Donald Trump announced the possibility that, once the tariffs take effect, there could be a reduction or elimination of income taxes for individuals earning less than US$200,000 a year.
“When the tariffs cut in, many people’s income taxes will be substantially reduced, maybe even eliminated entirely. Focus will be on those earning less than $200,000 a year,” the Republican president wrote today on his social media platform, Truth Social.
“Also, massive numbers of jobs are already being created, with new plants and factories currently being built or planned,” he added.
“It will be a bonanza for America!!! The External Revenue Service is happening!!!” the U.S. President concluded.
This week, a coalition of twelve states, led by the attorneys general of Oregon and Arizona, filed a lawsuit seeking to block the tariffs imposed by Trump, arguing that the tariffs are “illegal.”
The lawsuit aims to block the imposition of a 145% tariff on most products from China and a 25% tariff on most products from Canada and Mexico, important trading partners of the plaintiff states.
It also challenges the 10% tariffs on most products imported from the rest of the world, as well as the Trump’s plan to raise tariffs on imports from an additional 46 trading partners starting on July 9.
It should be illegal to publish anything trump says with any level of sincerity.
If I knew how to make emojis I’d include this one.
You have to follow through now and add it.
If I knew how to add emojis to the list I'd include this one.
I’ll try to add it when I get home, failing that I’ll bug our emoji experts to teach me how to do it, failing that I’ll just beg our emoji experts to add it while calling me a blockhead.
I can add it when I get to my computer
you can just post it to c/emoji and hope WhyEssEff gets to it
Oooor I can roll the dice on whether or not I break the site by trying to do jt myself
that does sound more fun
This is not the first time he has said this. He was saying this since before he was elected if I recall correctly.
His plan is not getting rid of taxes. His plan is shifting taxes from income tax to sales taxes (tariffs). His plan is to further shift the tax burden onto working people. Corporation owners will offload their tax burden by including the cost of the sales taxes into the cost of the product. It will be even more difficult to tax capitalists.
This could lead to complete government collapse.
Income tax is not a bad thing. You should be getting services in return for the taxes that you pay.
if the government is in control of the magic money printer then idk i would argue that yes not only are income taxes unnecessary and bad but also the only real point they end up serving is as pointless shit for people to argue over. It’s the Republican version of the Democrats holding the save abortion football like we’re Charlie brown. Oh, better vote for us, we’ll lower your tax burden, and if we don’t well The Democrat Party ™ will definitely raise them!
also maybe it’s from a fever dream but i’m pretty sure i read a pretty convincing thing about how money taxes really originated to begin with to integrate soldiers into the economy i.e. if you pay your soldiers money, that’s worthless if nobody needs money, but if you charge a tax in money- woah, all of a sudden people start wanting to feed and shelter your soldiers
so in summary, i don’t like paying taxes
A heavy progressive tax is explicitly one of the things that Marx calls for in the Communist Manifesto as a prerequisite for the conditions needed for developing a Communist revolution. Countries which are run by Communist parties have income tax. What you are saying is historically incorrect and nonsensical.
Trump is also not calling for the end of taxation of working people. Read the article. Read the article. He says that he wants to shift the tax burden. He wants to tax the working class for things that they buy. Working class people will be paying more taxes overall. He believes in some absurd concept called the External Revenue Service where he believes that he can tax labor outside of the US.
I do not believe paying income tax to the US federal government will create the conditions for communism
I did not say that income tax in the US will lead to communism.
Both posts by Wizard say that income tax of laborers is never justifiable. “no amount of hand waving about how the government needs to take workers at the point of labor will make it true”.
I mention Marx talking about progressive income tax, as an example of how income tax is not only justified by Communist Theorists but also beneficial to the working class.
A progressive tax is a tax where wealthier people pay a higher percentage of taxes than poorer people. A regressive tax is a tax where wealthier people pay a lower percentage of taxes than poorer people. Income tax in the US is a progressive tax. Relying on tariffs to fund the government would be a regressive tax. Trump wants to replace a progressive tax with a regressive tax.
A progressive tax is good because it makes it harder for capitalists to accumulate wealth. Trump wants to eliminate income tax because it is a progressive tax and he is a capitalist.
The trickery of Trump in this situtation is not that “he doesn’t want to eliminate income tax”. The trickery is that he is saying he only wants to eliminate income tax for people earning less than $200k, but in reality, he wants to eliminate all income tax, including for people making over $200k. Then he wants to replace income tax with a new tax (tariffs) which taxes working people at a higher percentage than capitalists.
In Finland the bourge is doing exactly this by raising the VAT, creating all sorts of new regressive taxes (like a sweet tax) and disguising it as “taking care of the national debt” which for some reason still is able to fly as an argument for the libs.
They are currently also trying really hard to dismantle the last parts of our very high progressive income taxation which I would argue is the last thing standing behind the remaining relative equality here. A tax cut that only benefits very high earners was just announced, along with further easing on taxes for capital.
Income equality has been quickly eroding here since the early 90s (income inequality rose in Finland faster than in any other OECD country during the late 90s to early 00s) and one key development behind this was a tax reform. Capital income tax was decided to no longer be progressive and this along with austerity measures and capital accumulation is the nail in the coffin for the welfare state. The same reform was done in Sweden and Norway around the same time.
no you see actually income tax is a fundamental pillar of society and is actually necessary for communism, marx said so
motherfucker don’t tell me to read a fucking article when I said what I said, I didn’t say shit because trump said this or that or waht the fuck ever
I don’t care what Marx said either
“it’s nonsensical” do you think “income tax” was a think for all of history? lick my whatevr and leave me alone, nerd
“Marx was a dipshit” is quite an interesting take on an ML social media site.
i didn’t say “marx was a dipshit” tho thx
Correct. You literally said “I don’t care what Marx said” then made a vulgar sexual comment.
I don’t know why you are so angry about paying taxes, but it makes you sound like a white man in Oakley’s driving a pickup ranting on Facebook. The disregard, the straight up hostility, to theory makes the chuddery even more apparent.
I don’t know why you are so angry about paying taxes
angry about shit like this
makes the chuddery even more apparent.
eat me
It’s fine to disengage but pump the brakes, comrade
hell yeah
if the government is in control of the magic money printer then idk i would argue that yes not only are income taxes unnecessary and bad but also the only real point they end up serving is as pointless shit for people to argue over.
This is just not true. A government that employs 20% of the nation’s labor is taxing 20% of the nation’s economic potential. No amount of financial hand waving about money printing vs income taxes vs sales taxes will change this at all. You’re paying for the government no matter what.
and no amount of hand waving about how the government needs to take workers at the point of labor will make it true
So, basically your claim is simply that it is better to take worker’s money at the point of consumption?
I never said they need to take it at the point of labor. But they are taking it and thats unavoidable unless you get rid of the government.
Under the view you’re expressing, taxes are necessary for a number of reasons, the two most primary being 1) giving a value to the currency in the first place, and 2) controlling inflation.
- no it doesn’t
- looks around at all the inflation happening anyway
also maybe it’s from a fever dream but i’m pretty sure i read a pretty convincing thing about how money taxes really originated to begin with to integrate soldiers into the economy
That sounds like David Graeber Debt: the First 5000 Years.
im pretty sure it was a david graeber thing but i’m not sure if it’s from that bc im aggressively illiterate
Graeber definitely references it, but the theory is older than him. I read the article he referenced in Debt.
Don’t worry you will get a tax break, but like normal everything else will skyrocket to get that saved money and more into corporate and healthcare ceo hands like always.
I thought we were supposed to get a 5k check in the mail from Elon gutting all those agencies?
Out of curiosity, I went to the main Trump forum to see how they’re talking about this. Here’s what they’re saying:
That there is a sovereign citizen. Or they just adapted sovcit language. I think they’ve learned not to bring up maritime law right away
The “False legal identity” is a big giveaway to me
“Legal but unlawful” is pretty funny too
Yessss I haven’t seen one of these cranks in awhile
Income Tax is actually an unconstitutional bill of attainder rendered by the false government controlled by the British Admiralty.
(Sov citizens are one of the funniest forms of false class consciousness)
My perception is that Americans hardly pay any tax as it is tbh
I pay about 1/3 of my paycheck in taxes every 2 weeks. Then another 1/3 for rent and the last 1/3 is groceries.
Ok so about the same as up here. Glad to have my perspective corrected.
I know there are specific states that have less tax, though, right?
It’s not really true unless you are wealthy enough to have an accountant shuffle your money around for you. Most states end up around the same amount once all is said and done cause that’s how much it costs to run a state.
Makes sense. Well then fuck, sucks all over doesn’t it?
doesn’t Nevada have no state income tax?
Yeah, but you have to live in Nevada to live there.
options include “Shitty Vegas” and “Smaller and Even Shittier Vegas” (Reno)
but my friend jerma 985 lives there
When States have low income/sales/property tax they pretty much always have a higher income/sales/property tax to make up for the difference. This part doesn’t really make it into the discussion cause it’s sorta complex and most American just like to whine about the tax rate in general and nothing beyond that.
Yes, we pay federal income tax and state income tax. Some states have variable income based rates, some are flat. Iirc there’s some state (North Dakota maybe) that has zero state income tax for lower income people.
Don’t get me started on how sales tax disproportionately affects lower income people.
Ik Florida has no state income tax. As a result you get shit public services and also you’re stuck living in Florida lol
As a result you get shit public services
The other states with taxes have good public services, right?
Not great compared to other developed countries but noticeably better. New York State has more resources for neurodivergent people than Florida and I believe their SNAP benefits give out more as well.
You don’t have to tell me, been working poor my whole life but i would like to get you started because i steal other people’s words for conversations in real life so my positions sound smarter
I’m sure you get the gist then
For arguments sake let’s say someone making 100k a year and someone making 50k a year both consume the same amount of necessities. Therefore they are paying the same ~10% tax on groceries, gas, clothing, household items, etc. While they both pay the same amount of sales tax, in reality, the tax burden is doubled on the 50k earner. They have half as much money but are paying the same amount of sales tax.
Personally, I think sales tax should just be abolished, but that’s in a world where that lost tax income is coming from taxes on high earners and the wealthy.
Texas, New Hampshire, Florida, Nevada, I think South Carolina, there are a number of states with no state income tax
Yeah, State income tax is reduced in some places. My federal taxes are ~$250/wk while state taxes are ~$50/wk. That’s middle of the road for state tax. I know California and NY charge a lot more, but they also get a lot of that with higher property taxes. Which I wouldn’t have to pay because I don’t own property.
Also it’s not technically a tax, but health insurance is another $100/wk for a plan that requires me to spend $8000 out of pocket before they even consider paying for anything. If I don’t take that employer offered health insurance, I have to pay an additional tax penalty at the end of the year that goes to the health insurance companies, so it’s kinda a tax.
Brutal
Hey, they gotta pay for those warplanes and missiles somehow. Awesome how the roads and infrastructure around us is totally collapsing and taxes keep going up for poor people.
Am glad my boss got that PPP loan though. Him and his son got new houses and cars when they cashed it out then laid everyone off.
No income or sales tax in NH, but it’s not a good thing. It actually makes taxes regressive because property tax has to be so much higher to pay for the schools. People in poor communities pay sometimes 10x the property tax rate for much worse schools.
Rich people basically pay 0 taxes in America, people that work a job do pay taxes they just dont get anything for it. lol
Yeah, I often find my little brain is cluttered with stuff from hearsay or fictional media. Learning!
Don’t bother trying to understand American taxes. It’s fucking insane.
The government withholds money from your paycheck for taxes. Makes sense, right? Except in most cases, they withhold more than you actually will end up owing the government. The IRS knows ho much money you’re making, and they know how much you owe or are owed. But instead of just sending a check or bill, they make you calculate it yourself every year.
most low income americans end up paying very little in income tax (but only if they get their ducks in a row)
Just to pile on more info. There are dozens of minor taxes levied at the federal, state, and local (usually municipal) level. In some states with a flat tax rate, these are used to make up for the lost revenue which a progressive tax would have brought in.
You can bet that someone has considered a lemonade stand tax. That’s the level of specificity
Aren’t the tax rates in the west and specifically in America the highest on account of their currency’s position?
It can vary. The effective federal income tax rate is around fifteen to twenty percent for most earners. There’s another 7.5 percent or so for federal benefits (Medicare and Social Security). State income taxes vary from zero in a few states to thirteen percent on the highest income bracket in California, but probably average out to five or six percent. Most (or all?) states require employees to cover some burden of their unemployment insurance as well. Some municipalities also have income taxes.
Americans also usually pay taxes on their homes, cars, and sales tax.
And rather than just paying taxes for health care, your employer deducts the cost from your paycheck and gives it directly to a private company, but this is not considered a tax.
i’m not sure what your perspective is, might be true tbh, but paying Federal taxes pisses me off because i know i pay a shit ton more than assholes who make 5-30x my salary and it all goes to the war machine instead of social programs / welfare.
living in california making $65,000 pays ~$16,000 of income taxes. income is the bulk of tax, but additional taxes are: sales tax (~10%), 1.2% property tax, vehicle reg, gas tax, state disability insurance tax, parcel taxes, etc.
remember when he was going to get rid of the tax on tips?
The chuds will believe that this has already happened, and will phone in ICE raids on any restaurant worker who claims it hasn’tthere is no tax on tips if you don’t declare them!
wanna help a server, tip in cashhhhh
and overtime
Never thought about it before but yeah taxes on overtime are bullshit, you probably even get taxed at a higher rate than normal so you’re making less than that stated time and a half
Nah, overtime is taxed at the same rate because it’s just income. Even if it were to increase one’s income to the next tax bracket, only the portion of that income over that tax bracket would be taxed at a higher rate.
It is, but it’s extremely common to hear people complain that more OT = more taxes. Probably because of brackets
Really it’s just because of our piss poor education system not properly explaining these things. I’ve seen an adult decline a raise because he thought he’d get taxed more than the raise, even after over an hour of us walking him through why that wasn’t the case.
Once the tariffs take effect…
He already said we are making billions in tariffs…so which is it?
Genius PR move. He gets to look the part of the populist to his base and conveniently deflects blame to his opponents when it inevitably fails to pass.
I’ll believe it when I see it
“possibility”. uh huh. sure.
but as a thought experiment, if he did somehow eliminate federal income tax for that many people (and presumably financed it by some combination of printing money, shutting down major federal programs like medicaid, etc)… Would he just be god emperor for life in the minds of like 70% of americans? I guess the high would wear off pretty quick and its not a trick you can pull twice, but idk, it feels like it might win some people over. maybe enough to overcome the “but the constitution” pleas of the libs (not that it takes much he’s already almost there)
of course if he did it by making everything cost double which seems to be what he’s proposing then I feel like people wouldn’t react positively besides the usual rubes
Why yes sir I would not objectI’ll believe it when I see it.
This alone could be good, (though they should only eliminate it on slabs of, say, <$60k), but they will combine it with austerity so that it is net regressive for the poor, the tariff shock doesn’t help either.
Also, doesn’t Congress set the rates and slabs?
It’s net regressive for the poor anyway since it’s just shifting the tax burden to consumption taxes because everything you buy will cost more because of tariffs. Consumption taxes always disproportionately hit the poor.
1000%. If this becomes the hot topic among your coworkers, insist on bringing up the simultaneous cuts to social and welfare programs. Trump doesn’t give a shit about the poor or even non rich
