I disagree that narrative = Long meandering cutscenes.
I mean I agree that this isnt necessary. Its about tolerance levels I guess. Im very into these things, and also dont think theyre as common as people make them out to be. If you dont like them, then that game isnt for you. I really cant name many games with cutscenes so long they put me off and the only one that comes to mind isnt a JRPG, its MGS2 (and it only put me off because the final cutscene crashed right at the end and if I wanted to beat the game I would have had to replay the final section lol). To be fair, I havent played the last two Final Fantasies I heard the cutscenes get really bad in XV and XVI, but the ones before it the cutscenes were not offputting to me. So I guess its just a taste thing? I get why someone might not like it, but its very for me so I’m glad they exist.
I also disagree that the narrative is (always) the core engagement, as I do not often find it to be very engaging.
Narrative is, for me, the engagement that sets the JRPG genre apart from other genres (particularly specifically WRPGs). As explained by Extra Credits in this fairly short video series: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_rvM6hubs8
EC also argues that the “abnegation” of grinding is a core engagement but it never was for me so I dont usually bring it up. But thats a thing as well.
If you dont like them, then that game isnt for you.
And that’s where the disagreement with this post comes in. If I enjoy the gameplay, but don’t enjoy the long cutscenes, then I’ll just skip those and enjoy the game, instead of forgoing something I find enjoyable because someone else thinks I am doing it the wrong way.
Every game has narrative and that narrative can be presented in a lot of different ways, which is why I put the parenthesis in there. Narrative isn’t just cutscenes and tbh games that rely heavily on cutscenes in order to communicate its story is often a game I perceive as having a pisspoor narrative, because it fails to utilise its medium. When you phrased it as core I perceived it as if you meant the only, thank you for clarifying
I mean I did say “to me” in the title. I personally dont get why someone would skip the story in a JRPG to get to more combat, because the story is why I’m there and the combat is secondary at best (luckily this is usually the case) and a chore in the worst but luckily rare cases. So yeah its all just how I personally see things.
I can see how this mechanic could work for some people though, I admit.
Yeah and I tried to answer why I would want to do it. I can see how I could have put more emphasis on making it my personal opinion.
Playing a JRPG “for the story” is backwards to me, because I’ve never played a JRPG that had a story that was in any way as engaging as those that are common on film, TV and in books.
because I’ve never played a JRPG that had a story that was in any way as engaging as those that are common on film, TV and in books.
I guess for me, they might not be as engaging as some of the stories told in those mediums (YMMV, some of my favorite stories are JRPG ones like Chrono Trigger and FFX) but they are different ones that I still want to experience and are the reason why I’m at the rodeo.
Yeah fair enough, I just feel like anime scratches that “JRPG-story” itch for me and does it better. It’s completely subjective at the end of the day, so I can’t legally fault you for that.
Narrative is the core engagement of JRPGs but its not the only engagement. The combat is still there, part of the game, and if the game is good then it will be engaging as well (sometimes it isnt and I admit in that case the game would have been better as a movie or maybe a kinetic novel or something, though also reception of JRPG combat can vary by taste). In fact EC actually does argue that abnegation through grinding is a core engagement for many (just isnt for me, I like JRPGs when either the grind isnt necessary because the progression is well balanced, or when the grinding is fun because I find the battles engaging in more than an abnegating way).
I mean I’ve argue for awhile that the owner of JRPG IPs should make animes of their games so people who dont like them can still experience the stories. Because I get theyre not for everyone. But for me, the mix works perfectly when its done well (even if I skipped battles as a kid).
ETA: It should be noted that i originally wanted to tell my stories through the JRPG medium, then decided that KNs (Possibly with coroegraphed JRPG combat to express the battles, still figuring out how action scenes will work) was the way to go about it. So I totally get how a story is better told that way.
The narrative is the core engagement. I will repeat this until the roof comes falling down.
I disagree that narrative = Long meandering cutscenes.
I also disagree that the narrative is (always) the core engagement, as I do not often find it to be very engaging.
I mean I agree that this isnt necessary. Its about tolerance levels I guess. Im very into these things, and also dont think theyre as common as people make them out to be. If you dont like them, then that game isnt for you. I really cant name many games with cutscenes so long they put me off and the only one that comes to mind isnt a JRPG, its MGS2 (and it only put me off because the final cutscene crashed right at the end and if I wanted to beat the game I would have had to replay the final section lol). To be fair, I havent played the last two Final Fantasies I heard the cutscenes get really bad in XV and XVI, but the ones before it the cutscenes were not offputting to me. So I guess its just a taste thing? I get why someone might not like it, but its very for me so I’m glad they exist.
Narrative is, for me, the engagement that sets the JRPG genre apart from other genres (particularly specifically WRPGs). As explained by Extra Credits in this fairly short video series: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_rvM6hubs8
EC also argues that the “abnegation” of grinding is a core engagement but it never was for me so I dont usually bring it up. But thats a thing as well.
In FFXIV I get fucking hype if i see the warning for an unusually long cutscene pop up
And that’s where the disagreement with this post comes in. If I enjoy the gameplay, but don’t enjoy the long cutscenes, then I’ll just skip those and enjoy the game, instead of forgoing something I find enjoyable because someone else thinks I am doing it the wrong way.
Every game has narrative and that narrative can be presented in a lot of different ways, which is why I put the parenthesis in there. Narrative isn’t just cutscenes and tbh games that rely heavily on cutscenes in order to communicate its story is often a game I perceive as having a pisspoor narrative, because it fails to utilise its medium. When you phrased it as core I perceived it as if you meant the only, thank you for clarifying
I mean I did say “to me” in the title. I personally dont get why someone would skip the story in a JRPG to get to more combat, because the story is why I’m there and the combat is secondary at best (luckily this is usually the case) and a chore in the worst but luckily rare cases. So yeah its all just how I personally see things.
I can see how this mechanic could work for some people though, I admit.
Yeah and I tried to answer why I would want to do it. I can see how I could have put more emphasis on making it my personal opinion.
Playing a JRPG “for the story” is backwards to me, because I’ve never played a JRPG that had a story that was in any way as engaging as those that are common on film, TV and in books.
I guess for me, they might not be as engaging as some of the stories told in those mediums (YMMV, some of my favorite stories are JRPG ones like Chrono Trigger and FFX) but they are different ones that I still want to experience and are the reason why I’m at the rodeo.
Yeah fair enough, I just feel like anime scratches that “JRPG-story” itch for me and does it better. It’s completely subjective at the end of the day, so I can’t legally fault you for that.
That feels like it defeats the point of video games as a medium.
I’m going to suggest the same Extra Credits videos I just suggested to Egon regarding the core engagement of JRPGs
Narrative is the core engagement of JRPGs but its not the only engagement. The combat is still there, part of the game, and if the game is good then it will be engaging as well (sometimes it isnt and I admit in that case the game would have been better as a movie or maybe a kinetic novel or something, though also reception of JRPG combat can vary by taste). In fact EC actually does argue that abnegation through grinding is a core engagement for many (just isnt for me, I like JRPGs when either the grind isnt necessary because the progression is well balanced, or when the grinding is fun because I find the battles engaging in more than an abnegating way).
I mean I’ve argue for awhile that the owner of JRPG IPs should make animes of their games so people who dont like them can still experience the stories. Because I get theyre not for everyone. But for me, the mix works perfectly when its done well (even if I skipped battles as a kid).
ETA: It should be noted that i originally wanted to tell my stories through the JRPG medium, then decided that KNs (Possibly with coroegraphed JRPG combat to express the battles, still figuring out how action scenes will work) was the way to go about it. So I totally get how a story is better told that way.