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Ha!
As a middle aged man you think its great for us? You think all the hot, sane, independent women in their 30s and 40s are strugging for options? If you’re on there theres a 80% chance that you’re no catch either.
Last time my dude showed me a bunch of profiles it was easily 50% “applications to be a stepdad” and 25% women with a checklist (6 foot tall, good living, own house, etc.) Like 6 foot tall athletic lawyers who own their own home are having trouble meeting women.
Social media is raising expectations to unrealistic levels. As if Hollywood wasn’t bad enough for past generations.
You think all the hot, sane, independent women in their 30s and 40s are strugging for options?
You’d be surprised… My wife is in a professional dance company full of single ladies ranging in age from 20s to late 30’s. Most of them are on the struggle bus when it comes to finding a decent partner who isn’t a lazy bum or a rampant misogynist.
Tbh most of the dudes in long term relationships with the dancers are just regular everyday dudes. Imo the bar is pretty low nowadays considering that like 1/3 of dudes have been brain poisoned by Joe Rogan/Jordan Peterson.
Married dude here who has a lot of single dude friends. 1/3 is accurate.
And if it’s not Rogan, it’s some other right-adjacent influencer. It’s fucking weird too. They’re regular dudes, helping old ladies on the street and supporting a neighbor. Then suddenly, they crack and share how terrible women are.
Then you got women who are on the other side, complaining about how terrible men are.
I don’t understand it.
I mean, when there’s less cross-interaction nowadays and everyone’s in their own bubbles prevent a challenge their preconceptions, it makes sense.
This is affecting all facets of society, politics even.
Also there’s survivor bias: there is also the fact that on these platforms, the impact of assholes in the dating pool is much greater then the good ones, because it’s the same assholes being cycle through the system, whereas the good ones have already reached the terminal state and found their partner.
Honestly, some of the women I see have profiles that are basically demanding an incredible amount of labor from their potential partners.
No coffee dates, no walks. They want something planned out multiple days a week and in exchange they’ll put up with you grunting on top of them.
They want something planned out multiple days a week and in exchange they’ll put up with you grunting on top of them.
Lol, women enjoy sex as well my dude. With an opinion like that it kinda sounds like you may be stepping on your own feet there.
I’m referring to these particular women, not women as a whole.
There’s a type of woman who are essentially asexual, never masturbates, says they don’t really need sex, but still wants to be in a heterosexual relationship from either societal expectations or because they think a boyfriend is useful in other aspects of their life.
The bar isn’t low. Not being a lazy bum or misogonyst is the bare minimum (as it should be). The real bar is multiple bars in form of a 110 meters hurdles. You have to jump over all of them. Everything below that and the other person will feel as if they are settling.
Not being a lazy bum or misogonyst is the bare minimum (as it should be).
Idk, just judging by any post containing gender discourse on Lemmy…seems to be a pretty big hurdle for a lot of dudes.
You have to jump over all of them. Everything below that and the other person will feel as if they are settling.
That may just be a product of being younger. By the time you get to my age both men and women seem to be wanting to settle down and are more likely to compromise with the idea of an imperfect partnership.
That may just be a product of being younger. By the time you get to my age both men and women seem to be wanting to settle down and are more likely to compromise with the idea of an imperfect partnership.
I dealt with my share of toxic relationships. Happened in my late teens and early twenties. Late 20s and early 30s is when I and all my friends met good people we wanted sticking around and all got married.
A confounding issue is the apps themselves have gotten worse over time. Like, old okcupid you could search. You could type in like “final fantasy” or “the Mets” and find people who liked those things enough to put them on their profile.
Now you’re limited to whatever the app decides to give you. Well, the app doesn’t want you to leave so that incentive doesn’t line up.
A lot of the more popular ones, okcupid included, all got bought up by Match Group and almost immediately started trending anti-consumer in their updates or removal of features. They want you paying, they don’t give a shit about success.
100%. Match group should be broken up.
It’s an especially insidious type of monopoly to me because it deals with relationships, they can manipulate millions of people, affecting the creation of their families and kids.
Surprised that the religious right haven’t put them in their sites.
Close, they actively fight success. Legally obligated to, even. It’s their fiduciary responsibility to keep you using the app.
That’s not really how that works.
I’d love for you to be right. Please elaborate.
You don’t have a fiduciary responsibility to maximize profit, or anything like that. You have a responsibility to act in accordance to company rules and guidelines, and to act in the company’s interest, not your own.
There is no requirement to burn to company down to maximize short-term profits, like some people think. That’s usually at the expense of long-term profits anyway, so it could be better for profits to do something better for the customer.
You’re only required to act “ethically” and keep the company’s interests above your own.
If the company has a goal to make more money every year, then you can justify a lot of actions in that pursuit. And once they have a monopoly you kinda don’t have many options, so they can push more.
Saying they have a responsibility to keep you on the app may sound silly, but app user churn is most likely measured and has some goal around it. And if a goal is set around that churn then they very much have an obligation to keep you on there as long as possible.
There’s the alternative of trying to obtain more users, or also to retain users by being a better service (although it has to appeal to a different demographic than those trying to leave for this though).
They have a pretty universally bad name now, so obtaining new users only gets harder, and a lot of people leave even without finding a long term match because the service is shit. They can optimize for these factors without burning the place down.
They have no requirement to grow year over year either. That has nothing to do with fiduciary responsibility. It just keeps stock value growing. Prioritizing long term health at the expense of short term gains is perfectly fine a legal.
So capitalism is incompatible with dating apps. Who woulda thunk?
You also had decent profiles where you could write more texts about you. That could give you an idea of who that person is. There is a difference between “Tea or Coffee? - Tea.” and “Tea or Coffee? - I like green teas but also some black teas like assam. I sometimes bake scones to eat with the tea.” A lit of modern apps don’t even give you the option to show your personality more.
Fetlife is like that too. “Find people with the same interests as you!”… select an interest: 120K people! Okay, let me filter by location? No. Filter by age? No. Filter by sex? Guess what, also No. So instead you have to hand scroll through all the entries. I don’t want to spend a lot of time connecting with someone with a common interest if they’re on the other side of the world.
OkCupid used to actually work rather well at finding compatible people who were actually honest about what they were looking for.
Then it got bigger, got acquired, and the matching model of the whole industry was intentionally modified to be more monetizable, and to keep giving matches that are close, but not close enough to be truely long term compatible.
You aren’t using the app/website anymore if it works and gets you a successful long term match.
You are using the app for a longer time if you keep getting close but just missing the mark.
…
Do people not think their dating app is tracking… how many matches and text exchanges they have?
How much time elapses between you matching, chatting, leaving… and then going back to swiping?
And then multidimensional matrix comparing that to every other definable variable about you?
Including whether or not you say you’re looking for something long term, or serious… but you actually keep cycling through people?
These algos, these things… they know exactly to what extent you lie to yourself and others, and they weaponize that to keep people in a sort of optimal (for the app, not you), constant disappointment loop.
…
Everything digital is now way beyond ‘if its free, you are the product’.
The model is now entirely attention, addiction based, and manipulating your emotions in as close to real time as possible is absolutely integral to all this.
People forget that over a decade ago, Zuckerberg said his dream was to be able to predict with high accuracy what any given Facebook user would post next.
Nearly a decade ago, Netflix CEO or some such stated ‘our primary competitor is sleep’.
People largely do not realize the extent to which these corpo fucks have been running highly precise and targeted manipulation of every aspect of human behavior… all to drive goddamn ad revenue and market share, ie, entrench themselves as institutions the modern world is no longer imaginable without.
I’m just confused as to how there isn’t a dating app that is better.
I just got so sick of using the apps and their crappy interface. I can never remember if left is good, or right is good. Who designed that was a good idea?
The interface literally tells you as you do it which is which…
Millennial here. Have recently dabbled with the apps. Honestly the guys I was shown were not objectively bad looking. Many of them were pretty attractive. But not my type at all. My interests were books and video games and nerdy sweetness…and it kept recommending me muscle gym divorced military dads. So I gave up.
I don’t blame you. The algorithm is gonna force you to look at what people your demographic like despite whatever input you give it. At least it seems this way with how algorithms in general seem to work on social media. The amount of dick pill ads I get is way to high.
Yeah at first it is. The algorithm learns about you over time and it gets a little better with regular use. It still has a bit of a blind spot around nerd/geek culture.
Literally fuck algorithms. Anything that has one is dead to me, if at all possible.
Yes, they literally are fuck algorithms. 🤣
Not a fan of how corporations make them work myself but understanding a little about them can make things like this a little less frustrating.
I would argue that the existence of an algorithm isn’t inherently evil, they just ruin things when they’re designed to maximize profit.
Is it really in the apps interest to find your perfect partner or just ones that bring you back to the app again and again?
I’m not convinced they’re looking out for your best interests.
It may be more profitable to have regular success stories getting churned. The algo looks out for the best interests of the company’s profit. Sometimes things line up.
A fair point, so it’s in its favour to help maybe a tiny percentage find a tiny bit of success and then promote that success while everyone else pays.
Yeah. It’s just profit, whatever makes line be as up as possible. I doubt there’s any regard, good or bad, for the user’s experience beyond that.
Which app? Cause I can’t find the nerdy girls.
The algorithm just pushes all these women who are wanting someone who will house them and take them on worldly vacations.
I tried bumble and hinge, got the ick, and gave up. Yeah, I’ve heard people saying something similar; going on about women looking to be housed. It’s such a huge turnoff and it makes me consider their financial insecurity, to be honest.
Most people seem to accept living on debt or handouts. It’s strange. I see everyone around me (both sexes) acting the same. So it’s not even a dating app issue, I think it’s a people issue. Offer nothing and expect everything in return. Maybe it’s an American thing?
I don’t want to be grouped into incel mentality, but is there a dating app to meet people from another country?
I don’t know, it could be your immediate environment. I certainly noticed this behavior in some friend groups, but not others. I don’t think you need to go that far to avoid the behavior. Just be vigilant and expect reciprocity.
Most likely, this is because the nerds who know how to present themselves have already gotten nabbed by some girl. Nerds who are unable to present themselves well are relegated to the bottom of the pile, since nearly all women will swipe left on them. Jacked, divorced military dads are at least jacked, which is something many women find appealing, so they end up higher on the stack.
Yeah, I think you make a great point here. Most of my gamer friends are couples with children. Unfortunately, I have no interest in jacked dudes at all, but I think most people probably do lean into that on dating sites. I figure at this point and age if I meet someone, great. If not, I’ll be fine.
What kind of nerd stuff? You like Pokemon? 3D printers? D&D?
After the third/fourth gen of Pokémon I kinda lost interest. Whenever it was they started being jet skis.
Add tower defense and sim games to the list though. DnD based games, although I’ve played tabletop from time to time, just too much of an introvert to join a random group.
Anyways, when you’re swiping in my age range there aren’t a lot of folks with these interests in my area. Maybe I’m too old and get shown whatever.
I think a lot of nerdy people need to just start going outside and doing stuff. Like, if you enjoy DND roll up to the local hobby store and start hanging out, even if you arent playing.
None of this is targeted directly at you, just as good a spot as any to rant… lol
I think more people would be surprised that the horror stories are the minority. At my local game story I go to a painting night once a month mostly to hang out and chat. There are a pretty even split of women/men.
Point is I think this a safe spot to make friends and making friends is the only way to get into a relationship you’ll actually enjoy.
I met my girlfriend doing Star wars rp. My friend met his girl playing magic l. All my single friends have something in common. They don’t make time for their hobbies and don’t hang out with like minded people in that space.
Just a side note I’m not saying that everyone should go harass people at their FLGS or use it as a dating service, but rather, going out and hanging out with like minded people opens up a lot of options that aren’t on dating apps.
I’m pretty introverted too but when people are into whatever my hyper focus is it’s much easier to open up. Go out there! Be uncomfortable! Not a cure all but it’s something.
For me, the biggest impediment is really having to work a full time job. And being in my late 30s, a lot of these activities are described to be for 20-30s in the meetups app. I agree though, I’ve met some nice people at gaming stores when I was younger and had the energy. So this is good advice.
Let’s see, I’m in an entire server where people your age are playing pokemon tabletop. Ok, it’s not even funny anymore. I wanted to make a joke about how I’m single and into those things, but it really is like that.
I’d be interested in the server. Why are you making the joke? It’s okay to be single.
The joke is well we are pretty much the same, but complain about not being able to find partners. Reality: because we don’t want to. Lemmy users are not so different from Reddit users.
Ah yes, both big dumb pandas. At least were fluffy…? :)
I’m lean and short 🤣
Barely any tummy.
I still remember when bumble had to change their entire premise and business model because as it turns out women are worse at starting conversations than men lmao.
I wholeheartedly believe that the Internet and smart phones have been the biggest double edge swords in human history. We have the entire globes collected knowledge at our fingertips with the ability to connect with any other person on the planet instantly and it has caused the largest shift in loneliness and depression ever.
Humans simply are not wired for social media and the Internet. Seeing every single person you know posting themselves beautiful and dressed up doing the coolest things 24/7 will make anyone feel ugly and like they aren’t doing anything with their lives. It takes real focused effort to remember that people (generally) only post when they are doing something special and what you don’t see are the days or weeks between posts that show they live the same boring life you live.
I’m ranting for no reason. I think when we lost in person social gatherings as the primary method of meeting new people is when society kicked that concrete block off the cliff. Right now we are just waiting for the rope to snap taught and drag us all into the abyss.
Every starting conversation on Bumble was like:
“Hey”
In my experience the bot and scam scripts have become refined enough to seem exactly like a pretty disengaged or disenchanted user, or someone not confident in what they’re doing. It’s led to some awkward moments when I suddenly send “BOT CHECK”
If that happend, it triggered me so hard. Its like the insanest thing ever. Why are you even on bumble then.
Why are you expecting conversations to be otherworldly?
How many conversations in real life with people you like start with something akin to “hey”? I’m gunna bet most but I suppose I could be wrong.
From what I saw, it wasn’t just “hey”. Hey was the yellow flag.
It was all the one word responses. To everything. It was the job of the guy to be entertaining on the app to barely any response.
That takes its toll on men, especially when there were women who used it as a source of free entertainment.
This was eloquently written and I enjoyed reading your insights. I found your closing metaphor particularly apt!
Taut*
Humans simply are not wired for social media and the Internet. Seeing every single person you know posting themselves beautiful and dressed up doing the coolest things 24/7 will make anyone feel ugly and like they aren’t doing anything with their lives. It takes real focused effort to remember that people (generally) only post when they are doing something special and what you don’t see are the days or weeks between posts that show they live the same boring life you live.
I’ve never seen a friend post on social media about something and then felt sad. I’ve instead thought “That looks awesome! Good for them! I can’t wait to do something like that too, I’m inspired!”
I think when we lost in person social gatherings as the primary method of meeting new people
This is something only chronically online people say. Most people form almost all of their relationships offline. This is still extremely true of platonic relationships. Online dating has increased in popularity, but mostly this is among people with niche tastes or in remote locations, where finding a match is more difficult due to the rarity of finding potential partners in real life. Tons of people still date primarily via their social circle or community gatherings, and most people use a mix of all their options.
Given who runs “online”, that’s kind of worrying.
who runs
With these knees? I’m known to promenade gingerly online.
This is something only chronically online people say. Most people form almost all of their relationships offline. This is still extremely true of platonic relationships.
Where are you meeting these people, magic real life wizard?
Of the 5 I currently have in my roster, 2 came from online, 2 were friends of friends, 1 I introduced myself to at a rock climbing crag.
I also seek out partners at my job, at the climbing gym, at various meetups like for acroyoga or fire spinning or pickup ultimate Frisbee, at social bars or concerts or festivals, or just when I’m walking around in the park near my house. Importantly, I’m not just going up to every attractive woman I see and saying “nice tits, wanna bang?” - even though this is my truth in my heart of hearts. Instead what I do is show up, have fun, meet people, joke around, and just be a normal person. But then if someone is cute, I’ll do a little eyebrow wiggle or some shit during a break in the conversation, and if she eyebrow wiggles back, I escalate - like by tickling the back of her elbow or telling her that she’s, like, literally the worst why am I even talking to her. And then at the end of the night I say “hey, I think you’re cute - wanna hang out alone sometime and maybe do some smoochin’?” And then she says yes or no, I give her a high five either way, and I’m on my merry way.
Edit: I’ll point out that the number of partners I have from online is mostly because I have a good profile, so getting matches is pretty easy for me. Most people don’t have as high of a sex drive as me, and so won’t want to put in the effort. Going through social networks (real life social networks) or social hobbies is far more likely to net you compatible partners, since the choices you make in these arenas are likely to attract people with similar values and dispositions.
Well, that was a lot more than I bargained for. Also, gross.
if you are presenting yourself to the world at large would you not want to showcase your best self?
“no let me show myself in my skivvies talking to my therapist!” doesn’t seem like a lure for attracting a partner. just my two cents. And I am of the opinion that online dating is awkward, but that is about it.
I’m so glad I’ve never had to date officially. My first two girlfriends I met at school the latter of which I was in a relationship after school, which was good. My current partner is, strangely, also related to the school I’ve been to as we’ve met via a common acquaintance. Getting to know each other happened mostly via texts and then through meetings - unofficial dates, I guess - and the rest is history.
I can’t imagine the stress of using these dating platforms constantly. Putting yourself out the over and over again, meeting all kinds of people for a shred of possible companionship. Must be so exhausting. Don’t even wanna think about what the experience must be for women* and female-presenting people
I think we should make dating apps even worse, and just let humanity die out naturally.
I bet that the Pandas would step in and keep us going.
:D
I don’t know how you would go about intentionally making them worse. In theory they have a premium mode but in practise the premium mode is the “function at all” mode.
Schopenhauer did say as much I suppose. Except for the Tinder bit. Now to pin him as a millennial or a Gen Z…
oh dont worry. The right wingers will murder us all soon.
I am forklift certified. I do not need this.
I’d hate to be the one to say this, but that’s not what people mean by “picking up girls.”
How do young people meet new people these days? I met my husband while at work. Became official via Facebook status.
Here’s the great part; you don’t! (I am American and only going outside for vital activities anymore)
Same. And you can’t meet women (according to women) at any of those vital places. The general consensus seems to be don’t ask them out at the store, the gym, a restaurant, whether they’re working there or customers, any hobbies where they just want to be able to live their lifr without being hit on etc. To add, the only things I actually do still leave the house for? Walking on trails where they’d rather run into a bear than a guy on his way to a secluded spot near the creek with a joint and a book, so that seems like a bad way to meet people too now, and where I may have once talked to fellow trail walkers now I just keep to myself there too. I could still go to a bar, but like, I don’t want to, and the last few women I met were pretty bad alcoholics whereas I just drink a little bit sometimes. And even if a woman did approach me at one of those vital places or on the trail, I wouldn’t act on the hints because I’m absolutely positive they’re just being nice and they’re not into me, without them directly stating their intent using clear language.
It’s great!
Increasingly, they aren’t.
“that’s the neat part! they don’t!”
I got out of the game right before tinder became a thing. I’m just as lost as you
Dating is hard for everyone in one way or another, and, speaking as one, several ways for those who look pretty dead average but have trouble socializing and really only go between home and work. I don’t even feel like I’m that picky; no cigarettes, no kids, yes empathy, and a complementary flavor of weird/neurodivergence.
It’s hard for weirdos to find other weirdos because all weirdos have some level of social anxiety. Ask me how I know.
How do you know?
Make a lemmy community for dating.
I wouldn’t want to meet other Lemmy users in person, let alone date them.
Being a Lemmy person isn’t a great point of connection but it would be nice to see how they interact with other users in other Lemmy communities.
l mean, yea, weird, but not that weird.
I would, but you’d be too anxious to respond! (yes whoosh, I get it)
Pokemon Go will probably net you 2 of those at least.
Your weirdo will appear.
Survivorship bias.
:(
I am putting it out there for him. It’s all circumstance and luck.
I read this first as “it’s all circumcision and luck”. lmao
Sounds like the basis for a musical number.
Sometimes the no kids thing, can be a huge red flag, a lot of the incel / women hating types put no kids. There’s a lot of them out there and they’re really extreme, you might be limiting your dating pool by wanting someone who doesn’t have kids but then if you’re into never having kids, that’s a different thing, entirely.
first thing I tell my gf’s is I dont is don’t want kids. one was of agreement and now we have been together 10 years and got all sorts of money to spend to travel and pursue expensive dreams. Plus what if I had a ugly child I’d have to hug it? (just kidding)
It’s not necessarily a billboard I put up stating that I don’t want kids. I made the decision long ago, partially based on my upbringing and now the current world situation, to never have children, so I checked the boxes saying I don’t have, and don’t want, children. That’s it.
I never wanted to have kids, so that makes me an incel? We’ve lost the plot here, that’s fucking crazy, only women are allowed to be childfree now? And also I have heard if a guy likes children it’s also a red flag? So I’m either a child molester or an incel? I’ll take incel I guess, interesting “would you rather.”
I think you might just be wrong on this one, it’s entirely possible that men too don’t feel like bringing a kid into *gestures vaguely at everything.*
I’ve been curious if a government-run dating app could do better - if its goal is to achieve genuine engagement, not cycles of frustration that boost subscription rates.
This is one of many subjects where capitalist concern ruins the product (and that’s not even something I say as often as others on Lenny)
Honestly, 90% of the need for dating apps would vanish if people had more free time away from work and well-kept public spaces for entertainment that didn’t expect you to purchase anything.
So rather than a government-run dating app, how about a government-sanctioned 4 day work week and well kept public parks?
I don’t know if I buy that. I think people simply like hiding behind a screen for many interactions these days - including dating.
Not that Im against your idea but maybe just the 90% part seems inflated.
Perhaps, but we would need to put the idea in practice to determine what’s the cause/effect relationship here.
Are people more addicted to their screens because the real world became hostile, or is the real world becoming hostile because people are glued to their screens?
I’d bet on the first option, but I could be wrong.
Real relationships require a vulnerability that dating apps can not provide
But who makes the profit in your silly goose scenario? Somebody has to be making money or it’s a terrible idea!
You said capitalism and summoned your resident anticapitalist. How can I be of assistance, comrade. :D
Looking for an anticapitalist on lemmy is like looking for a lesbian at a Teagan and Sara concert. It’s not everybody, but it’s not a difficult search
meh, I dont think thats accurate. I would say “opportunist” is a better fit. Anticapitalists understand how profit extractions works and have a very different view on society. Mostly one that does not work on .world because of the capitalist propaganda machine running in the west.
I run a social club for gay men, and we’ve talked about coming up with an app that’s run by a non-profit, with social workers on the board, that’s designed to actually connect people, not keep them glued to the app. Friendship, dates, activity partners, whatever.
I don’t know why no one has come up with the non-profit model here but if I can get enough steam, we’re doing it.
But even non-profits need to pay for operating costs like salary and cloud fees. Where would you get the funding for that?
The app doesn’t need to be free, and the revenue stream won’t dry up if it actually works because people break up, and there are so many fucking people that even in a zero sum scenario it would take forever to reach saturation.
Sorry if I come off like a butthole but I’m both curious yet dubious of the idea. I feel like people probably have thought about it but they probably ran into the same problems you’ll run into.
You didn’t quite answer my question. Where are you getting revenue? Eg. Subscription, one-time fees for X, grants, investments, etc?
Duallingo started like a non-profit but even their revenue with its massive userbase couldn’t cover their expenses so they had to compromise hard to keep the lights on. The same happened to Coffee Meets Bagel. Hinge started with the same premise of “this app is meant to be deleted” but they also had to compromise and eventually sold to Match Group.
Also, I feel like gay men are a unique demographic that has higher that average engagement so Grindr is probably in a uniquely advantaged position to resist enshitification.
I guess I’m just saying it’s probably in practice a cost center like city infrastructure or schools or research, so it might only work without heavy compromises if it’s also funded by taxes.
Where are we getting the funds for Lemmy and its instances?
Donations and many self hosted volunteers, helped by the unique nature of the fediverse architecture also distributing burdens, fewer users, and lower computation/storage/availability requirements (compared to a more centralized service like a dating app).
It’s almost as if men are a little bit hornier than women…
That’s an outdated, lazy, and inaccurate generalization.
Women are just as horny as men but straight women experience higher risks engaging in dating than gay men experience resulting in more caution and selectivity engagement.
Straight women who are able to have as much sex as they want tend to be those who are in stable, long-term relationships. The bottleneck is safety as a hard requirement for sex.
“App” and “genuine engagement” are 2 things that don’t go together.
National Lampoon had an article once called ‘Girls of the Soviet Block’. When you said government run dating app, it made me think how hilarious that turned out.
sorry ladies, im exclusively looking for love on the Rumble forums
Here’s a concept: women over 29 years old don’t view Tinder as a good option for finding decent men. Therefore only the most desperate are the ones who sign up to display themselves on the digital meat market.
As a single (Maybe neurodivergent?) 30 year old male, what other option I have?
join IRL clubs, the first 5 to 10 times you go it’ll be painfully awkward, and I mean painful.
and the 5 few clubs you try will also feel painfully awkward.
but you’ll find a club you can’t wait for the next meeting. and you’ll make real IRL friends and connections.
just force yourself to attend.
Leave the house and find a hobby that women might also be into. Computers, cars? Mostly male dominated hobbies/women are afraid to actually go. Dance class? Now that’s fun, good exercise, and forces you to interact with other people, and there’s plenty of women there. Just make sure it’s something you’re at least kinda into. If you lie about your interest they’re gonna know and dislike you.
The other day I went to a watch party for the show Love Island and not joking, it was > 10 women to 1 man. I think there was over 100 women in that tiny room (definitely a fire code violation). But as soon as I started talking to a group about the show they were all over it.
This can backfire too though, since women assume any man coming to these events is just looking to hook up, so their guard is high. It’s also kind of shitty to make all extracurricular activities into dating events imo. People should have a space away from that pressure.
Honestly for me the best way to meet single is to have married friends who can play matchmaker. Of course that requires you to have friends, which brings us back to square one.
It’s also kind of shitty to make all extracurricular activities into dating events imo
You are telling me im not allowed to date. I personally hate going out to social events alone, its nerve racking, it makes my skin crawl. The ONLY reason I would consider it is because the alternative is I will never meet new people, and thus I will have a dating pool of 0 people. You don’t go out to social groups like some sort of creep hitting on every person, you go out to find people you enjoy spending time with, and maybe some of them are also people you consider pursuing romantically.
People should have a space away from that pressure.
Id argue that a social group is not and should never be that place, and that if you think it should be you should reflect on what responsibility a person has for their own emotions.
As someone who is overly worried about making myself an outcast for ever admitting my intentions with someone, but who knows this is just a fabrication of my own fear of rejection, it really upsets me to hear someone effectively confirming my own neurotic fabricated mindset. But again, this is my emotion, and is my own responsibility.
Honestly for me the best way to meet single is to have married friends who can play matchmaker
While this might work for you, id warn against externalizing the responsibility of finding you a date, because if they stop doing it, you stop dating.
I mean the flip side of what you are saying is that people aren’t allowed to have a social life free from romantic pursuit. Yes, it’s a thin line to walk but you are only seeing the view from a person with limited romantic opportunities, not the person who is tired of every social interaction being hijacked by dude number 67897 “out to find people you enjoy spending time with, and maybe some of them are also people you consider pursuing romantically.”
Like I totally get your perspective here. Doing things, and then… Organic relationship with no pressure. That’s ideal. The problem is that horny dudes hold this ideal in their head, and then use it to justify blowing up every coed activity in existence. You might think, “ok, if she says no, I’ll drop it” but the counterpoint is that this ritual becomes a chore for the other side of the fence. You are socially awkward, now imagine that any time you socialize in a group you have to awkwardly defend against someone’s iterative advances. And that this happens so often, it begins to color the way you interact with every acquaintance.
Yes, meeting people in group settings often leads to dates. But going into those settings with the intention to find a date is a recipe for problems. This is a subtle, but important distinction which seems lost on a lot of people.
When the ratio is that high, you can be certain there will also be women looking to hook up.
38 year old man here: you’re gonna be alone whether your dick’s in a woman or not. If you want companionship get a golden retriever and if you want your dick serviced be advised the Japanese do some pretty interesting things with silicone rubber these days.
No disrespect, I really dig your style. But man, this comment section keeps on giving 😂
So does the golden retriever!
My husband is 38, we’re eachothers best friend. Feeling alone even in company is a sign of depression, which we both have, and both have had, since we were children.
I’m glad to be there for him on his off days, and he’s there for me in mine. That’s what it’s about no? He doesn’t see me as a “dick servicer” though, so maybe that’s the difference.
I’m sorry you so feel alone no matter what though, must be difficult getting through some days
I don’t believe you. I do not believe a woman is there for a man in his off days. I’ve never seen that. Women do not support men, supporting a man is misogyny. They go on social media claiming to be “strong and independent” always in that order, and demanding heights and salaries that they will begrudgingly fuck for. “You take me on enough expensive dates and I might stoop to fucking you.”
That’s what the modern online-only strangers-only dating scene looks like. You will be alone with or without these women.
Look up “spool of wire guy.”
Our first date was a walk in the park because we couldn’t decide. We walked for hours. I felt safe enough to even go back to his spot after where we smoked cannabis and talked still, for many more hours. Our first date was like 6 hours long and cost nothing but a bit of gas for the drive.
The spool of wire guy, is that the fella who’s sitting outside reminiscing when he first bought that giant spool of wire and now it was gone? A very sweet, sentimental moment for thst guy.
Not gonna lie, some women are like that I’ve heard. I’ve never been friends with those types. Shallow people gonna shallow. Before I met my husband, most commonly my first dates were usually bar dates, where I would pay my own drink, or be turned down when I went to pay for it. I’ll insist to pay, but if they insist again to pay, I’d let them, and in response to a free drink, I’d tip the server that extra instead. That was my personal code.
Of course, dating online from me started 15 years ago, and ended 7 years ago when I met my love. What’s it like today? I don’t know. If I didn’t have my husband I know I wouldn’t go back to an app today everything humans touch has been heavily monetized, if even before it was only lightly monetized. I always used Plenty of Fish, idk if that matters.
It’s not good to generalize men, nor is is good to generalize women. You end up boxing yourself in. Better to treat each person you meet with no expectations, and you’ll never be disappointed. I’ve had some guys I’ve dated do really shitty things. There are guys who are willing to talk to you everyday for six weeks, spend two weeks more to hit the three date marker, sleep together, and then- they ghost. Some men will put two months of effort in to get laid, then ghost. It hurts a lot, especially when you think you have connection.
I never let it make me resentful towards all men, because I’ve also dated total sweethearts, they’re out there. I found one. Im lucky.
Keep hope, and maybe you will too. I truly believe I was able to score such a baddie (who btw at the time had the same income as I did) because for the year and a half leading up to him I did a lot of self work. Not working out, but addressing my flaws, my judgements, my quick temper. Stress management was what I needed most. Just at the moment I felt nearly whole as a single, I met my husband.
I serve him coffee in the morning, not because he expects it, in fact if I ask, he’ll say “no I’m going to get up in a second”, so I don’t ask, I just bring him one. I do it because for one, I like doing acts of service, it’s self serving as it makes me feel like im being helpful, and in return I feel good. It’s totally selfish first because “he’ll think I’m sweet and appreciate it if I do this for him”. The “aw babes you didn’t have to” gives me dopamine like nothing else. He always denies my help, so I deny asking and just find ways I can. It doesn’t go unappreciated, he is always greatful, and if I bring him coffee four days in a row, and on the fifth day don’t, he doesn’t even mention it, he’ll get up, kiss me and ask if I want Dunkin. He supports himself without complaint, and is always appreciative. My doing kind things is “extra” for him, and I feel the same. (Lol edit: I could absolutely describe my husband and strong and independent)
I’ve dated men who you bring coffee for four days, and not on the fifth, they’ve now expected my service, and complain. Some will even poke, “why didn’t you bring me coffee today? Are you mad? Did I do something?” And it would turn to a fight. Those men, are not the type I entertain much longer. As soon as I don’t feel appreciated and like I’ve expectations not my own, placed on me by someone else, I am out.
But second, my husband deserves it. Because whether I look good or like shit, whether I bust ass and handle business, or I lay on the couch frozen depressed, he still loves me the same. He’s earned my service over and over and over again, just by being a kind and helpful human to me over the years. So I return the kindness with more.
And to be honest, I don’t always know how to support him on depressed days. I don’t think he knows what to do for me either, but we both respond to each other’s moments with thst kindness. I’ll make a special dessert for him, or run an errand he doesn’t want to run that day. I make myself available if he wants to talk, He does similar for me. I annoy him sometimes with “is there anything I can do for you to help?” But I still ask, and give him love when he says no or idk. Sometimes what he needs is space, (hey me too) and we do that for eachother.
Give kindness and you get it back. It’s so silly but it’s how I’ve lived. It hasn’t shielded me from pain, but it sure does make more opportunity for kind moments in life. If you’re looking for a fight, you will find one. If your looking to spread kindness, you’ll find that returned too.
Best of luck out there, I know it’s tough. I hope you find someone, even if it’s a dog or a friend or a life partner, that shows you the kindness your heart needs.
Edit: it’s so corny, and I doubt you’ll watch it. But as a teenager I watched the movie “Under the Tuscan Sun”. Its a cheesy film, but with a really sweet message.
The woman is looking for love, and finds it, but not in the way she expected, it’s very sweet and I think helped me personally, in those formative years to drop expectations or at least, allow room for them to adjust. If you’re feeling lonely, no one will know you watched an old chick movie, and it might help you feel better to look at love differently as the woman is faced to in the movie. No one has to know you watched it lol
Yeah, I can see why you got the old nut and bolt, if that’s your take from Dan The Spool Of Wire Man. You didn’t get it anymore than his wife did. “I’ve had this spool of wire for 40 years, it used to be this big, now it’s about out.” He’s having some pretty heavy thoughts about his life, where he is in it, how much of it is left, what it’s all meant. And before he even gets a real chance to articulate all that, didn’t even get a chance to get to the feelings part, his wife interrupts him to give him shit about his hat. And just watch him shut down.
A woman that views that clip and perceives it as a “sweet sentimental moment” isn’t empathizing with men. Those men that pumped and dumped you, that you thought you felt a connection with? Yeah they didn’t, and I can see why. Gave you the old Phillip J. Fry: Just make up some feelings and tell her you have them.
As for all that crap about cups of coffee…In my home, if I want something to drink, I prepare it and drink it. If I want something to eat, I cook it and eat it. I’ve been single for a shade over 5 years now and not a single meal in my house has turned into a game of feelings jenga. And if I’m going to live the next 40 years of my life alone, sleeping alone, waking alone, eating alone, drinking alone, working alone, resting alone, dying alone, it will be a bargain price to pay to never again emotionally posture over who makes a fucking cup of coffee.
Casting a wider net.
Some people just have to work harder in certain fields than others. You’re skills may be in building, writing, gardening or something else but they’re not in attracting a wide variety of matches and that’s ok. I also suck at making dating profiles, don’t photograph well and don’t have the most interesting job.
I just need to put in more hours on Hinge and reach out to more people than a friend of mine who says he just opens the app and can get a date within the hour.
For context, if I’m actively looking I can usually swing one or two dates a month which is fine for my schedule as I work and have other things I’m doing in my free time. I’m also in my 30s so am matching with people who also have busy schedules which makes scheduling even harder.
nooo! can’t you see, as a male, that you want to be with a woman means you’re sexist, because you’re reducing the women to something that you want to be with for your own well-being. how selfish of you. men are the blight of society!
i’m so sick of today’s “feminism” which plays women and men against each other, setting society up for a great divide, all to distract from actual issues such as social safety-nets, eroding wages and exploitative working conditions.
I’m always surprised to hear people unimpressed with others on dating apps. A couple of my friends have shared their “feeds” and I was struck by how many good-looking people are out there. But they would swipe away from just the smallest turn-offs becoming deal breakers. Like if I saw these people in real life, I would think of them as average looking at worst, many being remarkably attractive. This is in the 20s to mid 30s range like the tweet. I definitely understand deciding you’re incompatible based on politics or religion or culture but most of the time it would be for minor quirks. It felt like they were spoiled for choice in my eyes.
But then again, they’re in serious long term relationships with conventionally attractive and supportive partners now so maybe being picky pays off. At the time, their reluctance to settle was a very frustrating experience for them.
Reluctant to settle, spoiled for choice, great ways of describing the situation.
the apparently-bottomless firehose of faces that makes you desensitized, the anonymous dismissal of them makes you callous.
The apps are just another dopamine slot machine, so the companies don’t care and in fact would rather keep people in their app.
Any dating app that was any good at its stated aim wouldn’t be able to make enough money to survive.
By definition dating apps don’t want you to meet a partner, they want you addicted to swiping and tapping and almost finding a partner. If you hook up a few times along the way then that’s just a secondary benefit and keeps that carrot dangling in front of you.
‘Look at all these people that think I’m pretty, who I could have if I wanted to.’’
It’s the mirror from Snow White, but it lies better the more you pay it, the more time you spend staring at it.
Skinner box.
Wire the rat up to stimulate its pleasure receptors if it pushes button.
Rat will push button untill it dies of dehydration.
There’s definitely a lot of people who overestimate what they bring to a relationship, and I think women are more prone to it than men because they’re typically the ones being pursued.
Apps will selectively group more attractive people together to increase the like/dislike ratio. So YMMV depending on whether you’re currently in the attractive group or not.
I saw a girl on tiktok say something similar about how after a shit day at work she will look at hinge and be even further upset about the people who have liked her on hinge, as though this is all she deserves in life.
It sounds extremely depressing out there these days.
That sounds very entitled of her. She can choose whom to like back. And if she isn’t happy with the options she has, she can go swipe on her own.
Let’s be honest, most men that use dating apps are those looking for hookups. So if you’re a woman looking for tge same then go ahead but you’re not gonna find a long term partner there unless if you’re one of the lucky few
I don’t know a lot of people that use dating apps but in my anecdotal experience all the male friends I know that use them are actually looking for a good long-term relationship. But you’re probably right that they are a minority.
None of the men I know that are using the apps are looking for hookups. There are many such men, but there are lots of people looking for other stuff as well.
most men then
What do you possibly base this on, the idea that men only care about sex and can’t want relationships?
i never said any of that
Didn’t answer what you’re basing it on though.
if you use these apps as a woman you’d know
Same with my male friends. I also met my wife on an app. This might be more of a you experience thing.
I also met my wife on an app.
ok so you’re one of those lucky few
