What ever you perceive as women ‘dating outside of their league’ is often times just women being exploited by men who are either older, in a position of power, or have money.
These women aren’t ‘dating outside their league’. They’re just being used as goods or a piece of meat. ‘Dating’ implies mutual romantic interest, not one sided infatuation reciprocated by objectification.
It’s not easier for women to date. It’s just easier to get sexually assaulted or taken advantage of.
and assuming there’s mutual romantic interest, and presumably there’s mutual sexual consent, how is it really sexual assault or being taken advantage of tho. Am i missing something?
well, that’s no longer power differential that’s called manipulation. i think this would be relevant if the guy (in this context) is using his superior wealth/looks etc to coerce the girl into having sex with him.
assuming if there’s sexual consent, and both agree to have sex, would it still be sexual assault or “being taken advantage of” tho. or are we to assume that by default, a woman is to be taken advantage of unless proven otherwsie? this line of thinking is somewhat misogynistic
Can be if we can’t assume anything else. So now that the terms have been clarified, the thing is: what’s the league here? Only physical attractiveness? Could it also be your own observer bias? Do you find in your life, just that much more plain-looking girls with hot men? I find otherwise, but it could be you’re just more noticing the dudes because they’re aspirational goals and girls as no more than a benchmark met that’s proving to your mind why these men are aspirational goals.
Yes physical attractiveness with no other attributes being considered. based on society’s general beauty standard (subjective).
the reason why i’m asking this is because - generally individuals date with others that are similarly attractive (my subjective opinion based on what i’ve personally experienced and seen around me). However, there exists a small pool whereby they date other individuals that do not have the same physical attractiveness. Within this pool, i’ve observed more less attractive women dating more attractive men than less attractive men dating more attractive women.
i’ve been talking to a few of my girl friends during catchups, surprised to find that all of them are like very stonks in their romantic life, and they told me it’s generally quite easy to date if they’re not picky. they’re average to above-average looking FYI. and it made me wonder whether this stonkness can be extended to women that are below average in terms of look. and from what i’ve observed the answer is yes. just wanted to gauge more opinion lol.
Putting aside that it seems unkind to refer to anyone as out of others leagues based on looks alone, there’s a lot of factors that people consider for long term relationships, and for some (see: demisexuals and the like), looks don’t even factor at all.
I don’t think there’s a disparity between whether more attractive men are dating comparably less attractive women and the vice versa. It just comes down to a matter of values and what they see in each other. Outward beauty is only skin deep, and when you’re in a relationship, you can become even more attracted to your partner as you get to learn more about their less surface level positive attributes.
So maybe your friends got to know their partners and decided that a 10/10 personality meant more to them than 10/10 looks.
Besides, from personal experience, looks take a lot of work to maintain. If they spend all their time on looks, there’s a lot less time for everything else.
Putting aside that it seems unkind to refer to anyone as out of others leagues based on looks alone, there’s a lot of factors that people consider for long term relationships, and for some (see: demisexuals and the like), looks don’t even factor at all.
Yes, everyone is unique and good looking in their own ways. But we cannot ignore that outward appearance is the main factor in modern dating especially when it comes to first moves and is what people base off their first impression. If it doesn’t matter what’s the purpose of dressing up etc to impress others.
when you’re in a relationship, you can become even more attracted to your partner as you get to learn more about their less surface level positive attributes.
Once they could get over that barrier/hurdle then they can get to know you imo. this applies to platonic relationships too i’ve noticed. Throughout my childhood i’ve noticed, especially in HS the loners (regardless of gender) tend to be people that just aren’t conventionally attractive.
So maybe your friends got to know their partners and decided that a 10/10 personality meant more to them than 10/10 looks.
i’m not sure where you got the impression that at any point I was referring to my girl friends when “I asked why unattractive women tend to be able to date men outside of their league in terms of physical appearance” lol. I’m more referring to rather extreme cases, people that look like Predator or Jabba the Hut.
I’m more referring to rather extreme cases, people that look like Predator or Jabba the Hut.
Then it actually routes back to the first comment on this thread, somewhat.
Certain niche fetishes that men in particular engage in, we’ll take the feeder fetish here to base this example on, often involve unconventionally attractive individuals who are often very vulnerable.
Take Obese Woman 1 (OW1 for short).
OW1 has a problematic relationship with food, and is physically obese as a result. This also poses a danger to her health and is likely already affecting her mobility. While this may be unattractive by current society’s standards, it can attract a partner with a feeder fetish.
Meet Feeder Fetish (FF). He’s a relatively attractive man, rich, accomplished, and he’s dating the human equivalent of, as you say, Jabba the Hutt.
FF could have chosen to date OW1 for the express reason that she’s already struggling with her excessive weight and health, because it’s easy to just “support” them by enabling their binge eating, and having them gain weight as a result.
The end goal here is complete dependence on them. FF can continuously push OW1 to eat more and more under the guise of “Oh it makes her happy”, until she’s completely immobile, bedbound and her health is in serious danger. Often, FF might actively resist or try to thwart OW1’s attempts at weight loss even if it’s with the goal of improving their health outcomes.
See this video where a relatively attractive man is upset because his obese partner wanted to lose weight, likely to improve her health. You can search up “feeder couples” on YouTube.
I’ve also heard of men with hero complexes that are specifically attracted to women who are undergoing a bad period of time in their lives for similar reasons, because they’re highly dependant on them, and once they get better, lose attraction and may even try to sabotage their lives to drive them back into a crisis state to regain attraction. (Ref: YouTube vid, Reddit Post)
These may not be healthy relationships, you might be looking at a potentially abusive dynamic.
While you cannot assume this for every relationship, often extreme relationships are based on messed up things behind closed doors.
So yes, in response to a prior comment you made about this - if a woman wasn’t picky she would be able to “stonk” in their relationships. But what risks are they not considering? What red flags are they purposely ignoring when they don’t think too hard about who they choose to date?
Tl;Dr: People can love any shape and size, but it’s not always for good reasons.
However, there exists a small pool whereby they date other individuals that do not have the same physical attractiveness. Within this pool, i’ve observed more less attractive women dating more attractive men than less attractive men dating more attractive women.
Feels apparent to me then that you have to remove them from this thought exercise, because they’re clearly functioning under a different criteria, unless we have to assume they vision problems.
But in addition to your friends’ comments, it’s imo the typical asian upbringing tends to produce women with decent-to-great management skills, basic hosting etiquette, and a strategic awareness of finances. You’ll note none of that involves looks. But even within looks, many women are at least socialized to at least wash their face and moisturize daily and do light makeup. It’s easy enough to be a catch for most everybody if you are a catch.
It’s likely the men you see grokked that immediately. Most guys run on a critical debuff on all of these dimensions, so if they can’t even be brought anywhere like a orang bersopan santun (tau jaga diri, tau how to chit chat with elders, tau jaga hati etc) then the (perceived) lack of beauty just adds to that. A lot of plain guys who score great-looking girls usually have made that breakthrough, and most great-looking girls, since the pickings are easier, can afford to critically assess esp since most guys, lawa or not, can’t even function as a decent human being in a romantic relationship.
ETA: but even if they’re plain, maybe their personal presentation is great, and that’s what makes the girls be into them. Unless you mean not only they plain, but pakai baju cincai with spenda koyak (true story I know this man) - why I bring this up: a person yg tau jaga badan (a well-maintained girl and guy) can use similar yardstick to assess if this dude is also a person who tau jaga diri in other aspects. It’s a red flag for them if you don’t even know to dress decently.
What ever you perceive as women ‘dating outside of their league’ is often times just women being exploited by men who are either older, in a position of power, or have money.
These women aren’t ‘dating outside their league’. They’re just being used as goods or a piece of meat. ‘Dating’ implies mutual romantic interest, not one sided infatuation reciprocated by objectification.
It’s not easier for women to date. It’s just easier to get sexually assaulted or taken advantage of.
and assuming there’s mutual romantic interest, and presumably there’s mutual sexual consent, how is it really sexual assault or being taken advantage of tho. Am i missing something?
The power differential not explicitly mentioned in her comment but that which forms the basis of her example.
If a boss makes you work overtime, you did say yes, right? Is like tht
well, that’s no longer power differential that’s called manipulation. i think this would be relevant if the guy (in this context) is using his superior wealth/looks etc to coerce the girl into having sex with him.
assuming if there’s sexual consent, and both agree to have sex, would it still be sexual assault or “being taken advantage of” tho. or are we to assume that by default, a woman is to be taken advantage of unless proven otherwsie? this line of thinking is somewhat misogynistic
Can be if we can’t assume anything else. So now that the terms have been clarified, the thing is: what’s the league here? Only physical attractiveness? Could it also be your own observer bias? Do you find in your life, just that much more plain-looking girls with hot men? I find otherwise, but it could be you’re just more noticing the dudes because they’re aspirational goals and girls as no more than a benchmark met that’s proving to your mind why these men are aspirational goals.
Yes physical attractiveness with no other attributes being considered. based on society’s general beauty standard (subjective).
the reason why i’m asking this is because - generally individuals date with others that are similarly attractive (my subjective opinion based on what i’ve personally experienced and seen around me). However, there exists a small pool whereby they date other individuals that do not have the same physical attractiveness. Within this pool, i’ve observed more less attractive women dating more attractive men than less attractive men dating more attractive women.
i’ve been talking to a few of my girl friends during catchups, surprised to find that all of them are like very stonks in their romantic life, and they told me it’s generally quite easy to date if they’re not picky. they’re average to above-average looking FYI. and it made me wonder whether this stonkness can be extended to women that are below average in terms of look. and from what i’ve observed the answer is yes. just wanted to gauge more opinion lol.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder ma.
Putting aside that it seems unkind to refer to anyone as out of others leagues based on looks alone, there’s a lot of factors that people consider for long term relationships, and for some (see: demisexuals and the like), looks don’t even factor at all.
I don’t think there’s a disparity between whether more attractive men are dating comparably less attractive women and the vice versa. It just comes down to a matter of values and what they see in each other. Outward beauty is only skin deep, and when you’re in a relationship, you can become even more attracted to your partner as you get to learn more about their less surface level positive attributes.
So maybe your friends got to know their partners and decided that a 10/10 personality meant more to them than 10/10 looks.
Besides, from personal experience, looks take a lot of work to maintain. If they spend all their time on looks, there’s a lot less time for everything else.
Yes, everyone is unique and good looking in their own ways. But we cannot ignore that outward appearance is the main factor in modern dating especially when it comes to first moves and is what people base off their first impression. If it doesn’t matter what’s the purpose of dressing up etc to impress others.
Once they could get over that barrier/hurdle then they can get to know you imo. this applies to platonic relationships too i’ve noticed. Throughout my childhood i’ve noticed, especially in HS the loners (regardless of gender) tend to be people that just aren’t conventionally attractive.
i’m not sure where you got the impression that at any point I was referring to my girl friends when “I asked why unattractive women tend to be able to date men outside of their league in terms of physical appearance” lol. I’m more referring to rather extreme cases, people that look like Predator or Jabba the Hut.
Then it actually routes back to the first comment on this thread, somewhat.
Certain niche fetishes that men in particular engage in, we’ll take the feeder fetish here to base this example on, often involve unconventionally attractive individuals who are often very vulnerable.
Take Obese Woman 1 (OW1 for short).
OW1 has a problematic relationship with food, and is physically obese as a result. This also poses a danger to her health and is likely already affecting her mobility. While this may be unattractive by current society’s standards, it can attract a partner with a feeder fetish.
Meet Feeder Fetish (FF). He’s a relatively attractive man, rich, accomplished, and he’s dating the human equivalent of, as you say, Jabba the Hutt.
FF could have chosen to date OW1 for the express reason that she’s already struggling with her excessive weight and health, because it’s easy to just “support” them by enabling their binge eating, and having them gain weight as a result.
The end goal here is complete dependence on them. FF can continuously push OW1 to eat more and more under the guise of “Oh it makes her happy”, until she’s completely immobile, bedbound and her health is in serious danger. Often, FF might actively resist or try to thwart OW1’s attempts at weight loss even if it’s with the goal of improving their health outcomes.
See this video where a relatively attractive man is upset because his obese partner wanted to lose weight, likely to improve her health. You can search up “feeder couples” on YouTube.
I’ve also heard of men with hero complexes that are specifically attracted to women who are undergoing a bad period of time in their lives for similar reasons, because they’re highly dependant on them, and once they get better, lose attraction and may even try to sabotage their lives to drive them back into a crisis state to regain attraction. (Ref: YouTube vid, Reddit Post)
These may not be healthy relationships, you might be looking at a potentially abusive dynamic.
While you cannot assume this for every relationship, often extreme relationships are based on messed up things behind closed doors.
So yes, in response to a prior comment you made about this - if a woman wasn’t picky she would be able to “stonk” in their relationships. But what risks are they not considering? What red flags are they purposely ignoring when they don’t think too hard about who they choose to date?
Tl;Dr: People can love any shape and size, but it’s not always for good reasons.
Hmmm
Feels apparent to me then that you have to remove them from this thought exercise, because they’re clearly functioning under a different criteria, unless we have to assume they vision problems.
But in addition to your friends’ comments, it’s imo the typical asian upbringing tends to produce women with decent-to-great management skills, basic hosting etiquette, and a strategic awareness of finances. You’ll note none of that involves looks. But even within looks, many women are at least socialized to at least wash their face and moisturize daily and do light makeup. It’s easy enough to be a catch for most everybody if you are a catch.
It’s likely the men you see grokked that immediately. Most guys run on a critical debuff on all of these dimensions, so if they can’t even be brought anywhere like a orang bersopan santun (tau jaga diri, tau how to chit chat with elders, tau jaga hati etc) then the (perceived) lack of beauty just adds to that. A lot of plain guys who score great-looking girls usually have made that breakthrough, and most great-looking girls, since the pickings are easier, can afford to critically assess esp since most guys, lawa or not, can’t even function as a decent human being in a romantic relationship.
ETA: but even if they’re plain, maybe their personal presentation is great, and that’s what makes the girls be into them. Unless you mean not only they plain, but pakai baju cincai with spenda koyak (true story I know this man) - why I bring this up: a person yg tau jaga badan (a well-maintained girl and guy) can use similar yardstick to assess if this dude is also a person who tau jaga diri in other aspects. It’s a red flag for them if you don’t even know to dress decently.